667 | Simple Sales Scripts That Change Everything

Last episode we talked about why just sell more doesn't work.

So the real question is, if pressure doesn't fix sales problems, what does? Today we're talking about one of the biggest hidden problems in sales.

Most salespeople have conversations, but they don't know how to guide them. And the fix is simpler than most leaders think.

Joel Fortner is joining me today to walk through some simple ways to lead better sales conversations with what to say, how to say it, and how to stop sounding like every other salesperson in the market.

That is coming up next.

Welcome to the Chris LoCurto Show, where we discuss leadership and life and discover that business is what you do, not who you are.

Welcome to the show, folks. I hope you're having a fabulous day wherever you are. Today's episode is for any leader with a sales team or anybody who sells anything.

So if you're selling something, you need to be listening to this episode.

Most salespeople don't struggle because they lack effort. They struggle because no one has taught them how to guide a conversation well.

They talk too much, they explain too much, they ask too few questions, and they don't know how to confidently lead a conversation from start to finish.

So today, Joel Fortner is going to be joining me in the studio. Well, we're in two separate studios, so welcome. Joel Fortner.

Welcome back to the show, Joel.

Thank you. Glad to be here. Two episodes in a row. How cool.

Two in a row. It's so weird. We used to do this in the same room. Now we're separated by 20 miles, 25 miles. Something like that. Something like that. Something like that.

So today Joel is joining us to get to some very practical, simple language shifts and conversation frameworks that instantly make sales conversations better.

So, Joel, glad you are here because this is something you work with people a ton on the stuff that we're hitting today. Yeah, totally. So I'm excited for this one.

Like, so it-- The reason I'm excited is that when people hear better ways to communicate, it's immediately eye opening and it creates immediate shift for them. When we give people language of here's how to say that, here's what to ask.

And I love those just eye opening breakthroughs that people get, especially when salespeople get it and they find like, gosh, there's such a better way to communicate with people.

Yeah, it's the I didn't know until I knew. It's the nobody taught me this or people taught me this way of doing it and I thought it was the right way.

So yeah, it is a shocker. Today, what we're gonna cover, we're gonna cover the biggest mistake that most salespeople make in conversations.

Massively important. How to frame a call so you sound confident from the start. If the person on the other end receives you as not being confident, then this is probably gonna be a call that ends quickly.

Also, how to respond to objections without sounding pushy. Words that build authority and words that weaken it. And the five questions every salesperson should be asking constantly.

So if you want your team or your salesperson or maybe it's you closing more and sounding more confident, this episode is gonna help you immediately.

So let's get to-- Let's just jump right into the core problem that most salespeople have in conversations.

The Core Problem in Most Sales Conversations (00:03:32)

So, Joel, when you-- you listen to, Gosh, I don't know how many sales calls from tons of different companies, tons of different salespeople, what is, like, the most common mistake that you hear salespeople making?

Number one is salespeople tend to just talk too much. And they talk too much about their products.

They talk about their service too much. Okay, thank you, Joel. That's enough. So the next.

Let me talk. Let me talk. Let me. Let me say all the words. Yeah, they just. They end up talking too much about their thing, and they. They explain too much.

They don't ask enough questions, and they have conversations with people, but they're not guided conversations. And so, like, it's like I said in the last episode that no one was born with advanced communication skills.

We have to learn them. And so sometimes the way that we communicate and the way. The way that we talk, it just isn't as good as it could be. And so we have to be able to recognize that.

And it's not about you not being authentic. It's just about learning better ways to communicate. But I see that stuff all the time.

And then sales people, often they lack a clear structure from start to finish, meaning they don't have a good plan and a call plan of how do I want to lead people on conversations?

So they talk to people, and they're helpful or they're kind, and they answer questions. But there's no leadership on the call. Why? Usually it's because no one has taught them how to communicate just at a higher level.

So, like, give. Just give a simple example of a, like, one of those common mistakes that people make in their, you know, talking too much or. Or, you know, not asking questions.

I mean, here's the thing. What you just shared totally makes sense. But I think sometimes people don't get it until they hear it. Yeah, yeah.

So let's just, let's just take a simple one. We can say someone, a salesperson calls someone back and they answer the phone and they say, hello. And it's like, hey, is Bob there? Yeah, this is Bob. Who's this? Well, hey, this is Joel with such and such company.

Hey, it looks like you, you checked in through our website about such and such. And I was just giving you a call back to answer any questions you have.

What can I help you with? And then the person says, yeah, I was looking online and looking for such and such thing you all have. And when do you get a price on that? And so, yeah, I can help you with that.

And then here we go, talking about the product or the service and we're having a surface level conversation and that's where they stay. And they end up talking about their product or their service for the next 15 minutes.

And now the conversation is immediately derailed. Yep. Because you're not guiding it down a direction. You're trying to be helpful. Yeah.

And you think you're being helpful, but you're not being as helpful as you could if you were actually armed with much better questions and a better call structure.

Right from the beginning of the call, we're off in a bad direction. So just to kind of explain this to most people, what you just shared is I call in, I say, I'm looking at your chainsaw. The 753 chainsaw.

Okay, let's talk about the 753 chainsaw. Yeah, that's what now we're going to talk about. The question should be, let me start finding, what are you actually needing? What are you using it for?

What are you experiencing? Why is it that you're calling, getting in and digging into as much possible information, not sticking on one product. That's right.

Which at the end of that conversation I might go, oh, well, I don't need that after all. Thanks. Yeah, because. Right, right. If I let's use the chainsaw example instead of saying and talking about the chainsaw, I'm going to say, oh, great. So I said, I'm just interested.

I'm curious, Chris, what'd you see about the chainsaw online? Did you read or hear something that got you interested in that one?

Well, oh, yeah, I read this and this and this. And the price was right. And this was the. You know, whatever you're gonna, you're gonna answer my question.

My. My name. I'm gonna go from there. I needed. Yeah. So it's like, so then I'm gonna find out what appealed to you, what caught your attention.

I need to know why the heck are we even really talking? It's not just about that chainsaw.

Something got you motivated before then to even take and burn the calories, to go on and, and fill out the website and want to talk to somebody and answer my call and something got you going.

And it's usually actually something emotional that got you going. And I want to find that out right at the beginning of the call.

And then I may say something like, so, yeah, I can absolutely help you with that. But it's like, what are you looking to use it for? And I'm going to dig in. I'm not just going to talk about the chainsaw.

Why are you interested? What are you looking for? Do you ever chainsaw? Have you ever run one before? What's the project? Is it because of the ice storm we just had and you need a chainsaw?

Yes. You know, it's. Whatever it may be, that's the direction I'm going to go. But I'm going to do it by design, not randomly. But this is just how I have my call structure set up.

And I think so many people, everybody listening to this is like, oh yeah, that's smarter. But what happens when you get on the call and there's the pressure of the sale? Then it is the.

But they asked about the 753. Yes. That's great, that's fantastic. Be curious, dig in, get information and then find out. Because you could lose the sale because the 753 isn't what they wanted after all. That's correct.

They diagnosed the problem and thought the 753 is what I need. A true expert authority servant seller doesn't accept the diagnosis. Right.

They ask questions to find out what problem are you trying to solve that you think the 753 or the 8 by 12 storage building or this particular machine or this particular service is going to solve for you.

But what if the prospect is wrong? You don't tell them they're wrong. You end up in a skilled conversation figuring out that's really not what they need. And then you end up recommending better solutions.

And you've built so much trust and you've positioned yourself actually as an expert and an authority in what you sell.

So a great way to kind of say this because this is stuff that we do all the time in Next-Level Life and leadership and sales processes.

Whatever is the-- Hey, understand somebody has self diagnosed. Let me get in with my expertise on what I know to also aid in the diagnosis because my answer might be better.

And if I treat them with dignity and help them to see that they need something different and it's not the, oh, I just took you to the most expensive product, the 7 might be too much for you.

You don't need that. And then I gotta almost have a guaranteed sale if I guide you to something that you feel really confident about. So what are some of the script things that you share?

Like what are some of the adjustments or what are, like what are some of the changes that you suggest to people? So let's look at these examples. Like a lot of salespeople will sound like this.

They'll say, well, let me tell you about what we do, or we've been in business for, or you know, we're a family business that's been around since 1638.

As if that makes me trust you more. You know, I see the price on the 753. Thank you. Yeah, exactly. Or you know, our product has. And who's that all about? It's about you. The job of a salesperson is not to sell someone.

It's to guide someone so that they can make the best decision for them. And so I was just on a sales training call this morning.

I had three different people tell me that one of the most powerful mindset shifts that they have made was the simple statement. And I wasn't even trying to make a big deal out of it when I was training on it was the simple statement of who owns what.

You own the process, they own the decision. Does that mean that you're an order taker? No. Does it mean that you assume the sell? No.

It's about having a detached mindset and being a true servant seller that asks really good questions and then makes really good recommendations and then says, which one would you like to do ultimately in what you're going to buy?

And yes, I'm oversimplifying things in our conversation, but that's how to approach it.

So we got to be able to flip this stuff around and not be talking about, Let me tell you about what we do, how long we've been in business and give the resume.

What a more skilled salesperson is going to sound like is, hey, Chris, before I explain anything, can I ask you a few questions to understand what you're even trying to solve? Or they're going to say things.

So help me understand what prompted you to even look into this. Now that's the again why the heck are we even talking? Because you're in control of that.

You're the one who checked in. You're the one who took up the referral from your friend who said, hey, you should call so and so I need to know that information to even know what's even on your mind before I proceed further talking about the 753 chainsaw.

Because I don't even know if that's the best thing for you. And correct me if I'm wrong, if I call in and ask for the 753 and you start giving me information, then I'm expecting a sales process.

If you turn around and put it back on me to gain perspective and find out things that, you know, I now have to own. Sharing, you know, to the question that you asked, now I'm not as focused on you being a salesperson and we have to really push this concept.

You've said them multiple times, the servant, salesperson, but what you're talking about is service. Right.

The thing that we have to recognize in sales is if you shift from giving information to serving the client, the potential client, then what you've done is you've moved out of a sales, you know, focus.

You know, the client is no longer stuck in a sales process in their own mind. They're now sitting you, seeing you as a salesperson.

They're in a helpful. You actually care what in the world I'm doing. And now I'm going to give you, I'm going to feed you whatever information I feed you.

But now my mindset has shifted, correct? Yeah, exactly. So some of these things I'm saying already in this conversation, they're meant to help put guard down, defensiveness down, anxiety down, which is what we have to do in the first few minutes of a sales conversation.

Because we have to assume they see us like a salesperson. Right. And what is their fear? That you're going to try to sell them something they don't need.

They're going to try to sell them something that's not going to work, something that's more expensive, that they can get from someone else.

And it's our job to build that trust and to help put them at ease. And we do that with skilled questions, not by talking about ourselves and talking about our product and service and our business.

That's the opposite of how you do it. Yeah. Powerful.

How to Frame a Sales Conversation at the Beginning (00:14:58)

So how do we, let's say, frame the conversation?

So if, if somebody wants to sound more confident and more professional and more like this perspective gathering, servant, instead of a, oh, Boy, I've got, you know, how much time to try and get somebody, you know, convince this person to give me money.

How should they frame that type of a conversation?

Yeah. So really good salespeople, they frame the call early so that buyers know a few things, that they know this is what's going to happen so that they don't feel pressure, and they know that this is actually going to be a helpful conversation.

And they know that the salesperson is going to guide me, that they're going to lead me, and it's not all on me to ask all the questions and do all the legwork that I can really fold under your wing, if you will, and go with you in this call.

So framing, it helps reduce that awkwardness up front in a conversation and it helps to build authority. Because when you use the frame examples like I'm about to share with you, you sound like you know what you're doing.

You sound like an expert, you sound like an authority, but you're calm about it. Like, the training I did in our program this month is called the calm guide training, because that's how we need to communicate, is we need to calm.

We need to communicate detached in calm, confident ways. So some examples of frames sound like this. Let's say, you know, you call in back to the chainsaw and you're like, I wanted some information about the 753 and I ask you what you know.

Hey, what did you see? Something about it on the website that intrigued you? Yeah, I like this, this, and this. Okay, cool. So, Chris, here's how I typically help people think this through.

That's a frame. Love it. Do you not immediately sound like you know what you're doing? Exactly. You're not a new kid on the block. You sell chainsaws all the time or you sell stuff from this, this tool company all the time.

Here's how I typically help people think this. You're now an expert in my mind with this is how I typically do this. Yeah, correct. And then I'm going to say I want to be able to ask you a few more questions to see what you're--

Why, why you're even looking at a chainsaw, what you want to use it for.

And if the 753 is the best option, I'll definitely confirm that for you and we can talk about next steps on that or what we may find, and I often find this out, Chris, is that there are some other options we can look at, and sometimes they're even cheaper.

And so does that sound fair to you.

Yeah, that sounds good. You have me right there. That sounds good. And now what does it signal to you that I can now follow your leadership?

So another frame feel served, not sold to. Exactly. Because the whole concept and a guiding principle of Persuasive-Servant Selling is that self persuasion is the most powerful.

That's why salespeople don't sell things. They help people persuade people to buy for themselves.

That's the trick. And you will sell more when you help people buy the way that they. That the way that we all want to buy, which is. I came up with it. It was my decision. Not. Boy, that Chris really sold me on that.

That's the last thing you want to hear as a salesperson. But on another frame example beyond the. Here's how I typically help people think this through is a little longer frame can sound like this.

So Chris, let's say you sell something that's a little more complicated, it's more expensive. You know, it's going to take a few meetings or conversations. You may use a frame like this.

So this first call here, like this is pretty basic. It's really for us just to get to know each other a little bit more.

I'd love to find out a little bit more about what you're facing, some of the problems that you're dealing with, some of the goals that you have, and just compare it to what you might be wanting.

Just to be able to see what that gap looks like. And then towards the end of this call, if you feel like it, it might be what you're looking for. We can talk about possible next steps.

Would that help you? You framed it like an expert. You put their needs up front and what do you communicate? I'm not going to try to push anything on you at all.

Exactly. You've put. We're just going to talk. Yep, we're just going to talk. Does that actually. And the question you have to answer, does that actually help me? Will that help you? Yeah, that sounds good. The answer. And I've moved forward. Yep.

Because it's signaling and saying, yes, I accept your process. Yes, I will let you lead. It sounds good to me. I can't. You know, the number of times that I have watched you from a distance, I've always loved it.

Because I, you know me, I hate selling our. I can sell other people's stuff all day long, but when it comes to our stuff, I just, I hate it. It's. It's one of those weird things when your name is on it, right? Yeah.

But it's been fun to watch people, you know, approach you and say, hey, tell me about this thing. And then you just guide the living daylights out of it in such a calm manner.

Like it's just. It's as if it's. Somebody just asked you, what's the weather outside?

And I think that's one of the things that when the, the stressor that people have, that pressure when you're in that calm mindset of, hey, I'm here to serve, you know, it takes the pressure off of saying the right sales thing.

I have to make this statement that's going to convince them to give me money.

When you're not even focusing on that, the level of calmness shines through. Which is another colossal confidence builder, correct? Yeah, that's exactly right.

Because the biggest confidence builder in that is knowing that I don't control your decision anyway. Doesn't matter. All I can do is do what I can do, do my job, do my training, use my skills to communicate, build trust.

But here's the bigger thing. If you don't believe in what you sell, if you don't have confidence in your product or your service, you can't do this.

Yeah, it starts with the business, the products and the services. And then how well do you know them? And how well can you help someone see that they actually can help you solve your problems.

And that's what you own as a salesperson, that if I'm selling to you, I don't control that, but I have all the confidence in the world and all the rest of it. Now let me do my job well and as a salesperson and ask very good questions.

Listen really well, communicate with confidence, communicate with clarity, ensure we're communicating accurately, ensuring that I'm drawing out any worries or hesitations or concerns that you may have about things.

What's the biggest point? I have to focus on you. I have to care about you. I have to care about, is there even a sale to be made here? I have to care about, can we really even solve your problem?

And then you build the trust, and if you can help solve their problem, the likelihood you're going to be able to increases exponentially. So the mentality going into it, and I love that you say, you know, you teach them who owns what.

Because if I don't own the decision, man, there's a lot of pressure off of me, right? Because if I have to own the decision, then I have to do whatever it takes to make you say yes.

And that's just a horrid place to be. That is a terrible sales process.

Words That Build Authority (and Words That Hurt It) (00:22:32)

But some of the things that you use. You talk about languages all the time. Not languages, but language words that you're using.

And you, you always have these great things that you say that aren't salesy at all. It just guides the process. Right. But when you're listening to some of these calls, you know, we've been a part of this stuff forever.

There's all these things that people can say to sound unsure, like they, they just, it just again tells you you're being salesy right now. What are some of those things?

What are some of the things that people say that makes them sound confident, sure and expert? And what are some of the things that just people pick through and go, yep, I'm being sold right now.

So you're talking about basically weak language versus confident language.

So weak language that salespeople want to avoid was Chris. I was, I was just checking. I was just checking. You sound so insecure. You sound just like I-- You're not a leader.

This isn't who I want to buy from. You just want to see if my wallet's open yet. Yeah, just checking. I was wondering maybe. I think you sound so uncertain about yourself. Stuttering. I'm not really sure.

I don't know. Hopefully it's all this loosey goosey non committal language. But the thing is, what is it about this though? It's incredibly normal for people to communicate like that.

But normal doesn't have to be where you stay. It's a matter of like, I have to be able to get that stuff out and be able to add some confident language in. And so you replace it with things like.

So let's take a look at. Insert the blank. So let's take a look at. Here's what I'd recommend based on what you shared. I use that all the time.

We have a conversation, draw out a lot of information, draw out problems and goals and concerns and have a really good quality conversation. Then I start talking about the solution, which would be one of our programs.

But this is way deep in the-- in the conversation. So I'd say so, Chris, so based on what you've shared, this is what I would recommend or this is what I would look at if I were you.

Now you sound like an advisor and an authority and someone who's going to guide someone. Or it could sound like the next step typically looks like this.

Or what most of our clients or most of our customers do in this situation is you hear the difference between that and just checking and maybe, and hopefully.

And I think it's a completely different shift, and it hits the prospect in a way that. That now they can be confident.

All right, So I have to backstep a little bit, because I realize asking that question, I'm sitting here thinking about how many people are like, oh, say this thing.

You know, Joel said to say this thing. And that's. You're still missing so much of the process.

So maybe I can state it this way, you know, push back on this until you are confident that you have gained plenty, you've served so well that you have the information to make that advice, to give that advice.

Here's the direction I'd go. Here's the next step or whatever. Don't say it. If you're not at the place where you're like, this is a person who's ready to make a decision, then don't close it that way. Right.

What other pieces of information do you not have yet? Would you agree with that? Because I feel like people go from the. They could jump straight to that because they think it's the language that closes the sale.

But once again, what we massively have to highlight is the servant process in between. Yeah, yeah. You serve by putting the focus on them and asking questions like this. But it's all.

All these questions work together in a con. When we tease them out like this, we pull them out on their own, and they're not standalone. There are examples of just how you more effectively communicate, first of all.

But, yeah, when you draw out enough information and you've had a quality, enough conversation, and you now can see, as the expert, this is what this person's facing, you can then make confident suggestions, and that's all they are.

You know, you used the word close a moment ago. I know what you meant. But you're not even closing them at that point. You're just.

You're now exploring solutions to problems or something that aligns with what someone's trying to do or a goal that they have, that's all you're trying to do and say.

You can say... So here's what I, you know, based on that, this is what I would suggest we talk about, is this, this, and this.

It's like, does that sound fair? It's like, yeah, let's talk about those. Okay, so tell me a little bit more about option one. Perfect. You've got an engaged person right there. And now we're talking about those.

And then we go on from there. And there's a process to do from there. Exactly. So let's say we got there. Let's say, and again, we're doing this in one episode of a show.

There's a ton to Persuasive-Servant Selling that, you know, that goes into the process. But let's say, let's say we've gotten them, we've asked tons of questions.

We believe we are at the place where we can now guide them into the right direction. You know, and another thing that I love to think about is eliminating, you know, take it off the table. I've asked you so many questions.

I know these 43 things do not fit. I'm not even going to talk about them. It's not even if you ask me the question about them, I'm going to bring back why I don't think it fits because of yada, yada, whatever. Right? I love to remove things because then it makes it easier for you. We're down to three options. Great. That makes it so much more simple.

Responding to Common Objections (00:28:32)

But let's say we're there and all of a sudden I start to get objections.

Any salesperson knows that in your early days of not really understanding how to handle objections, your confidence can tank in two seconds.

Experienced salespeople that have been doing it for years not understanding how to respond, their confidence tanks in a heartbeat. How should somebody respond when they get that pushback?

Well, first of all, we have to be able to see that objections are usually not rejection. They're simply uncertainty or a lack of clarity on the prospect's end.

That's what they are. If you could look at it that way, that the person just isn't clear yet, they need more information. We need to keep talking. It changes your mindset.

So look for an objection. Not you don't want it early on. What I teach and what any, you know, decent sales trainer out there teaches is you want to be able to communicate in ways and ask such good questions along the way that you don't even get objections.

Oh, Joel, that's impossible. That's not. It's like I've had and I've trained so many others to have conversations where sometimes they don't get objections when they did before.

Am I saying that you're going to 100% prevent them on every call? That's not what I'm saying. But there are ways to communicate better with good, skilled questions from start to finish in the conversation that causes objections not even to come out.

So first of all, that's what my bigger goal is. I don't even want you to have to face objections. But because they're a reality. We have to look at them in the right way.

They're not rejection of you. They're just a lack of clarity. And usually it means that you miss something. That's it. You miss some good question along the way.

That if you will have a learning mindset in an extreme ownership mindset, you can look at that and say, you know what?

I've just missed something along the way and I need to give more information to this person. That's where it has to start. Then you can hear an objection and then actually ask questions to actually get more clarity.

So let's change the situation. Because a lot of people are like, I don't want to know what to say exactly. Of course you don't. It's like asking someone to marry you and you're expecting them to say yes or possibly, and they look at you and go, no.

Or, you know what? I don't think now's the time. How do you handle that? Well, a lot of people are going to be like, oh, my gosh, I'm so embarrassed, and I feel horrible about myself. Why?

Because you weren't prepared to handle the objection? That's the whole point. You've got to actually know, what the heck do I even say when these objections come up? So I was working with someone this morning in our.

In our call, and he said that the common objections he gets are, I want to get some other bids from someone else. Someone right now is being like, yep, I hear that all the time.

Or, let me think about it. Yep, I hear that all the time. Or, let me. Let me talk to my spouse. Yep, I hear that all the time. And we were walking through. This is how you actually respond to those situations.

And so let's. Actually, I'd love to be able to share a little bit on this. I don't want to just tease people when they're saying it. So if someone says commonly, like, you know what?

Hey, I want to look at some other bids, the mindset is, well, I don't control that. They have every right to want to go look at some other bids. So that's what they should go do.

So you can simply say it's like, okay, totally get it. And so at this point, just in our conversations, Chris, is there anything that I have failed to share with you or as you think about us possibly doing this work together?

Do you have any concerns, worries, hesitations? That's so much better than what the common answer, which is, well, I'm going to tell you that the price is probably going to go up very soon.

And now what do you sound like? What do you sound like? You sound like a salesperson. That's such a better way for me to go. Well, yeah, I still don't know about such and such. Yep.

And now you can address it because you drew it out. So that's a good way to handle anytime someone's going to go and look at a competitor is act like you don't care, be detached.

You can't control it anyway. That's what the person wants to do. You, you need to find out, where are we right now? Where are we? And if you've done a really good job positioning yourself as an expert, you can then go on to say.

So if you don't mind me asking, who do you want to talk to? Well, I'm going to talk to so and so. And a lot of people will tell you because they don't have loyalty to those companies.

And so they'll tell you if they trust you and then say so if it's worth your time. And if you'd like me to also look at anything they give you, we can compare it just to be able to look apples to apples.

And so if you want to shoot anything over to me, you know, absolutely no pressure, but I'll happily walk through it with you as well, which is if you've done a good job building trust.

Otherwise you risk sounding like a salesperson when you do that. But you have to do it if you know the trust is there. That is the biggest key right there.

If you asked me, who am I going to talk to two minutes into the conversation, I'm not telling you. But if you, if you've served me like crazy and I see that you're coming at it from a, well, let me try and help you with this or that or what you're looking at.

Because here's what you just convinced me of. Because of the process, I might go look at somebody else and they've got a cruddy salesperson who doesn't serve me and you might help me look at their stuff, which is going to bring loyalty back to you.

Yeah, I'm going to be like, golly, you just. You want to make sure that I'm taken care of and that drives that loyalty back to you again.

Exactly. I literally just did this last week working with someone. That's exactly where we are in the process. We've talked two times and that's exactly where he was. He--

We have the trust where he was willing to tell me where he is and what he wanted to go look at. And this is exactly how I walked him through it.

We're going to talk again this week. But he's, he's sharing information with me because it signals to me that I've done some things right in communicating with him and built the trust and I've positioned myself as someone he can be confident with.

Ultimately, if he decides not to go with us, I'm going to take ownership of that and be like, you know what? I missed something somewhere, some way.

I didn't pull out information or find out something. But the thing is, is that this whole process helps you build the trust in the relationship where you increase the number of people who will do business with you.

Not that you will ever win everybody. That's just not a realistic expectation.

But we're talking about how do we simply gain more business from people where we are. The reason we're actually pushing it away, you know, it's.

When I go back to my early days of sales and the shock that people had sometimes there's a time I was selling a very high end product and an event and telling people, I mean it, very, very, very high end, very expensive, and talking to some business owners and saying, hey, listen, this isn't for you.

Let me give you some advice on things to do.

Go do this, go do this, go do this, go do this. And they're like, you're not going to sell me a ticket? And I'm like, no. Like, are you kidding? Isn't that what you're in business for? I'm like, no, I'm in business to help people.

My goal is to help you. And taking your money for an event that you're not ready for doesn't help you.

And I mean, people that were just blown away.

The thing that I loved and just didn't even think about it happening until it actually happened was a year later or a year and a half later when some of those folks would come back and go, hey, I did what you said and it worked.

Here's where I am. I'd love to come to your event if you're good. And I'm like, yeah, absolutely.

Look at, you're in a great position now. Now's a great time. Let's do this thing. And the. If you want to feel great about yourself, yeah, totally.

Knowing that you served somebody to the point of pushing them away from your stuff and they come back later going, man, I did it.

You know, and advising, I didn't just tell them, no, you can't do this, I gave them advice on what to go fix and what to go do and then them coming back and it had such an impact that they're like, here, here's my money now.

And that just is phenomenal. It's so powerful. Which is kind of what you're speaking to, correct? Yeah, it all aligns. Yeah. Yep, it all aligns. So obviously we're speaking a ton about trust and loyalty here.

You know, I, I am somebody-- I'm an 88 S. I am somebody who, if you have served me in sales, I will be brand loyal to you, even though I might could get it cheaper somewhere else.

And this depends. It depends, right? I'm not going to be stupid with my finances, but I will come back to you repeatedly because you've served me in the process.

Not just, you know, I didn't feel like you were out to just take my money.

How to Sound Like a Trusted Authority (00:37:55)

So what separates that type of servant salesperson from the average person? You know, what makes a person sound like a trusted advisor compared to just a salesperson?

So beyond what we've talked about so far in this conversation, trusted advisors, they don't rush, they slow things down, they don't chase, they don't over explain, and they guide people clearly and calmly because the language they use, the questions they ask, that all assumes leadership.

That's the thing.

And that's what I love about like, you know that because we are a, at our heart and our core in our companies, that we are a leadership organization and we can see how effective leadership shows up even in selling.

But a lot of salespeople don't think of themselves as leaders. They think of themselves as salespeople and revenue drivers.

You're not, you become more effective when you're better trained and you're able to lead people in conversations and in the process, because you're doing the things we're talking about.

So some examples of this like of more authority building script examples is you don't say things like, you know, so what do you want to do, Chris?

You know, what do you want to do? You say things like, so based on what you shared, here are the two best options I'd recommend you see the difference big.

Or instead of saying, let me know if you have any questions, you say, so what questions do you have so we can make the best decision here?

Or instead of saying, I'm just following up, which is just normal language and normal salesperson language. Right.

You say things like, so I wanted to reconnect to see where this sits on your priority list. Right now. Hear the difference. Huge. This is leadership language. This is authority language.

We think the phrase, hey, I'm just following up is me leaning in your direction. And you sound like a salesperson. And you sound like a salesperson. That's what you sound like. Yeah. So there's nothing about that that motivates me to reply to you.

Right? Nothing. I feel pressured, but I have to respond. There's just nothing. But here's what a lot of salespeople do and like, in fairness into sales teams, and I've done it as well.

Well, you know, is that you're banging through all your tasks, you've got all these people to follow up with. You grind it out every single day and you're just trying to follow up with the next person.

Maybe because your sales leaders breathing over your shoulder, making sure that you're accomplishing your tasks and staying on top of everything.

And you're just like, I don't even believe in this. Chris. Hey, this is, you know, whatever, you know, just following up about our conversation last week about such and such.

You know, just get back to me whenever you can. If you're still interested, however I can be helpful to you.

And then you send it. What about that would ever motivate you to get back to me? It's just a bunch of words. You had to spend a bunch of energy reading them and they mean very little to you unless you are super duper ready to buy.

Yeah, that's the difference. But most people, they're not. We've got to be able to word it in better ways that compel people.

Sometimes the best email to send, and I was, this was another thing that came up up on a, on a training call today. Sometimes the best email to send is, hey, Chris, are you still interested in such and such send. That's it.

Sometimes that's the most effective email to send on a follow up email. Or if someone's ghosting you. Since we're talking about follow up, let's talk about it.

Or if someone's ghosting you and not getting back to you. Chris, hope you're doing well. Hey, I've sent you two or three emails and I haven't heard back from you yet.

How do you want to proceed from here? Send these emails, hit different and they get a better response rate rather than, hey, I'm just checking in. I was just wondering if you were still in the market for such and such and this vehicle.

And we've got some new inventory here and here's the link to it. If you want to. And I'm like, oh my gosh, like, how much more work do you want to put on me, you know, just to be able to follow up back with you.

But it just doesn't work as well. Right. It's funny because I've had probably about six, eight months ago, I checked in on, on a side by side.

I was just driving by, stepped in, wanted to see what these things look like and you know, got the whole sales process. In the middle of the sales process, I wanted to go, hey, let me help you.

But I was like, no, just let him do his thing, roll with it. And you know, they're trying to get me to purchase that day and all kind of stuff. And I'm just like, I'm telling him this is the information I'm looking for.

Well, let's get your address and let's get your. And let's fill out this paperwork. And I'm like, this is the information I need from you right now. Well, we can, you know, and it's just like, oh, this sales process sucks.

And I eventually did give them like here, here's an email. You can send me something on the email because I did want to know. There was a question that I had that I was looking answered for.

And I've received two or three emails since of the just checking in, see if you're still interested. And one bad start. But then the we've got our new fleet or we got, you know, suggestions of what else I might want to buy.

Which tells me you never listened to. You don't know what I'm looking for because you're offering a sale of something else. And it just tells you how bad that process went.

Yeah, right. And that person is thinking, man, I sure hope this guy buys. I hope he. Exactly.

So let's talk about that one right there because the examples are great to learn from, you know, just to make it up on the fly here, things that I would want to ask you if I was a salesperson.

I see you, you come in, maybe I see you looking around at some stuff on the lot.

If I walk up and you're, you see me come in, you're like, oh God, here comes the shark. Here comes salesperson.

And I know I've got to build trust and I'm going to ask you and say, I'm going to introduce myself and I'm going to ask you a very simple question of like, so what brings you in today?

You know, hey, looking for a side by side, you know, whatever it may be say cool.

It's like, what's. What's got you interested in looking in those? And I'm going to be super chill about the whole thing. What has you interested. Is there. Is there.

Are you looking at different options or are you specifically interested in this one right here? And it's. I'm three questions in. Yeah.

In 45 seconds of conversation, I'm already three questions in which unfortunately sometimes is way more questions than some people ask in a wholesales conversation.

Right? Yeah. And the. Let me get your information down and let's fill out this paperwork and let's do this. How about we do that later? How about you just find out whether or not you can serve me right now?

Because they couldn't. Is there even a sale to be made here? Yeah, the process assumes there is. Yeah. That's the thing is that if.

If he would have paid attention and again, there was the option of a sale to be made, but it would have required them coming down considerably on a price which he teed up that it might could happen.

And that's the part where it's like, okay, well, when it does, let me know. But if right now there is no option, there's no sale to be made. You're not making a sale with me today.

Did he ever ask you what property you own or how you're going to use it and what you're going to use it for? Right. But the other fun thing is. And this just drives me nuts.

Please, people, listen to this. The other fun thing is he got his manager, the guy that's like a year older than him, you know, to come out and say, hey, well this is the best that we can do.

And I'm like, I want to just talk to you two guys right now and tell you, yeah, this is so salesy. This is the worst process. But I'm just like, you know what?

I now I just want to get out of your building because of the way that you've so, you know, supposedly served me, which has not been serviceable. Yeah. But that's the typical thing.

And in fairness to all sales teams and salespeople listening, it's normal. It's just a skill and a training issue that we can learn to do this better. Exactly.

And if, you know, again, my heart in that moment is I want to talk to them, but there's no possible way in that setting that they're going to take sales advice from me.

Right. And you just want to get away. I just want to get away from them. What they need is Persuasive-Servant Selling. They need to actually go sit down and go, how could we have sold you?

You know, what could we have done differently? And learn the things that you're talking about and learn what questions they could have asked.

The Top 5 Questions Every Salesperson Should Ask (00:47:03)

Which by the way, let's just, let's jump into that.

You know, what are. Give some questions, give five questions that somebody should ask, ask that they can lead this process. Well, like what are some things they could ask?

So if you do not have questions or a script of any kind, you know, there are five go to questions that I use all the time and I teach others to use all the time. Number one is what prompted you to start looking into this right now?

It reveals urgency and motivation. That's number one. I've shared variations of that in throughout this episode. But at the heart, what prompted you to start looking into this right now?

Because I want to know what's motivated you and where are you in terms of urgency? Because if there is no urgency, there usually is never going to be a sell.

Number two, what if you tried already? So if I were you on the side by side, you better believe I'm going to find out that you own one already.

Tell me about that one. What do you like? What do you not like? How'd you come to get it? What do you love about it? Now that you've logged all these hours on it and what have you learned?

What have you come to hate about it? There's got to be something. Yeah, I'm just pulling stuff out. That's where I'm going to go with those follow up questions to that.

What have you tried already? Or what have you used already? Because it reveals effort and it reveals frustration that someone may have and it's emotion.

Most sales are made on emotion, not on logic. So number three is a question that's about exploring consequences is hey Chris, I'm just curious, like what happens if this doesn't get solved?

Or the right variation of that question. You have to tailor the questions to your business and what you sell.

But what happens if this doesn't get solved? Because this is all about exploring consequences that if the status quo is where you're at, that would have pulled all that out.

Communication with me right there. Yeah, it's like right there. Especially if I found out what your problems are. Exactly, Exactly. That would have, that would have.

I have not responded to them in the two or three emails, but that right there of helping me to think through.

Now obviously I already thought through my consequences, but if somebody would have Asked that like, what, what if this doesn't work out? You know, what is, what's the outcome you're looking for?

Type of thing that would have kept me in communication of going, huh, okay, if I don't solve this, what am I going to do? And that could have kept the door open right there. That would have been a great one.

Yeah. One thing that's often overlooked when it comes to good question asking is we assume people know stuff and they're just aware of it or they've processed through it, or they have clarity.

When you ask a question that gets someone's brain to activate to their mouth and then words start coming out, it has a powerful psychological effect because you're getting them to process in their deeper thinking and translate it into words that they're communicating to another person.

You cannot overlook the power of getting people to communicate back with you because what's the most powerful form of persuasion?

Self persuasion. You're not telling me your consequences. You're telling yourself that if I keep living in the status quo, nothing changes.

And as I share with salespeople all the time, what is your number one enemy in selling? It's not the competitor, it's not the objection. It's the prospect choosing to do nothing.

Yeah, that's the issue. We need to get them to persuade themselves that, hot dog, I do need this side by side. And because I know, like and trust you more, I'm going to buy it from you.

So we're only three questions into the five, Chris. But just to close this out, the fourth question is what would a great outcome look like for you? And it defines success early and clearly in the call.

What would a great outcome look like for you? Especially if you're spending a lot of money on something. If you're building something again, it's or it's a high risk type of a purchase.

What would a great outcome look like for you? Sometimes people haven't even thought about that or they haven't processed it clearly enough.

And then the fifth question I've shared this one earlier in the episode is what concerns or hesitations do you still have?

Or as you're thinking about different options here, Chris, what concerns or questions do you or hesitations do you have at this point? Yeah, nothing. This has been good.

And you see how all your great question asking along the way left them with no objection, right? No objection. And that's how you do it. So you can get to a place where you're drawing it out if there's no objection at that Point, it also can.

Can be the indicator that there isn't a sale to be made. Correct? It could be. But if you. Not if you've asked the right questions to draw that out, because usually where that goes is that's going to go to a.

So at this point, Chris, it's like, do you want to proceed and do you want to go with this route or do you want to go this route or how would you like to proceed from here?

Right. And now you've moved it to a trial close question or a closing question, which if there really is an objection, it's now going to squeeze out. Exactly.

And now what do you do?

You ask a question about the objection and you discuss it and then you have a quality conversation about it and then you ask, so at this point, so what are the questions, any of the questions or worries you have at this point, clear the deck of hesitations and worries and concerns and you're going to sell more.

Yeah. So powerful.

So one of the other things we've talked about is the script concept. Right. That you should have. I mean, you are a massive advocate of having scripts, but so many scripts are just. They're terrible.

Yeah. And a lot of people hate them. Yeah. And we've all experienced the person, you know, that you call some customer service somewhere and you, you, you can hear them in their three ring binder going through their scripts and stuff.

I get it. I'm on both sides of it. Right. I'm there as a consumer who can't stand the script piece.

Like, I'm just please get through this. But I'm also on the sales side who understands when you have the right stuff, the right scripts, it's insanely powerful.

Why Scripts Actually Create Freedom (00:53:51)

So like, how does somebody get to this place that they've got high quality scripts as opposed to sounding like, you know, a robot somewhere.

Yeah. So first of all, some people hear scripts and they think robot and that's. It's actually the opposite is true. Because you brought it up earlier.

You were saying that, Joel, basically you were saying is you can't just take this script that we're talking and just surgically apply it or transactionally apply it. Yeah, it's.

We have to use scripts within listening skills and empathy and other things that cause us to build trust.

In relationship scripts, though, if you use them the right way, they don't make you sound robotic, they make you sound prepared.

Because we're talking about language that doesn't come natural to a lot of us. And we have to write it down and learn when Do I use this? But you're not using it like a robot.

Like, they said this. I say this like, that's not, that's not how it's supposed to be.

It's about preparation. And I don't know about you, Chris, but when I feel more prepared, I feel more confident, I feel more relaxed and I feel like I can do a better job communicating with someone.

Well, something that, you know, I say over and over again is when you are prepared, it allows you to be flexible with what you say. When you. I've literally had--

It just cracked me up thinking about conversations with somebody when I've told them, hey, listen, I know you're using a script and you're going to have to say this and this and this.

When you get here, can we just jump to this part? And I've had people literally say, can you please just hold, please, and just let me go through this process?

Oh, you got a lot. That's okay. You know, talk about just doing a job. Then we get to the part where I'm like, this is the part I wanted to jump to. Yeah, I, I think when, when that's your process, it's just, it's just terrible.

Right. But the amazing thing is when you know your stuff, you're not looking at a three ring binder going line by line. Then all of the things that you're talking about become easier, more comfortable.

You can think on the fly because you already know the information. So it's not, oh my gosh, what does my script say here? You already know the information. So when somebody throws you a curve ball, oh, that's a great thing to know.

What about? And then you ask another question. So yeah, the preparation piece gives you that flexibility to lead them in another direction if something you're not prepared for comes out. That's right.

So another way to say it is scripts equal preparation, which allows you to be more authentic.

And that handles the objection of someone who's thinking, right now, I just want to be me and I just want to communicate with people how I naturally do authentically.

Then scripts are for you. Preparation is for you because that's what's going to allow you to be more confident and still be who you are. Not trying to become somebody that you're not. You should never try to do that. Yeah.

So powerful stuff. What can people do? Like right now? One, start asking more questions. Go back through this episode and write down some questions that you need to start asking immediately on sales calls today or tomorrow.

Like all the episodes we do are little classes on things. And we bring real stuff that we coach our clients to do.

So first of all, it's do that and start moving on. One or two questions this week. Whether it's a connection question or a way to frame a call, just pick something. What I have learned in coaching people for a long time is that top performers don't wait.

They take action. Exactly. They strike on motivation they have right now and start doing something different. Yeah. So you have to be listening to calls, though, right?

I mean, as a sales team leader or a leader that has people, you have to be listening to sales calls. Start by listening to the sales calls. Start by identifying the weak language. So don't, you know, you really have to kind of remove yourself from your.

What you own as far as a product or a service and just start looking and listening to this stuff as if this was me, if I was on the other end.

What's the weak language that you're hearing? You're not going in and going to hammer your salespeople. Don't be saying this. You know, you're going to go and say, hey, let's. Let's work with some of the alternative stuff.

And again, going back and listening to this episode 17 more times will help with that. But give your team the better questions. You know, write down better questions. Massage those.

Obviously, practice some of the objection responses you're going to hear. If you're listening to calls, you're probably going to hear a handful of common objections that people give. Great. That's fantastic. That's going to allow you to do exactly what you said.

Load up the. The responses so that you can remove or handle the responses in the discussion ahead of time so the objection doesn't show up and then jump to building the simple conversation frameworks. Right.

So if you will just do these five things now, there is a ton more. Yeah. Which is a lot. But if you can just jump in and do these five things, this will make a huge difference on what's happening on your sales team.

Right? Yeah. And also I just, I just thought about this, is that we just. We've put out some. Some reels on Facebook and Instagram recently where you're talking about some cell stuff and little sound bites.

And you can go find one of those reels, guys, and you can comment Scorecard below it and it'll send you an amazing new resource that we created. It's called Scorecard.

It's for sales leaders to be able to do exactly the things that you just said than a lot more so go to Facebook, Facebook or Instagram, find one of those reels, comment scorecard.

We'll take care of the rest. That's so good, man. Such good stuff. And you are so correct. This, these are many classes on things that you can do, folks.

Persuasive-Servant Selling Program (01:00:09)

If you want to learn more about persuasive servant selling, you know, and our Persuasive-Servant Selling program, go to chrislocurto.com/servantsales one word, servant sales and just get in and get the information.

If this is something that can help you with your communication, with your team's communication with setting up people so that they feel served as opposed to feeling sold to, then wouldn't it help to just get the information?

So. chrislocurto.com/servantsales. Joel, as always, fantastic stuff. Thank you for joining. Loved it. So good. Again, you've just your expertise on this stuff is just phenomenal and it's always fun to watch and it's always fun to experience.

So thank you for joining us. Yeah, thanks, man. Well, folks, that is all that we have for today.

One thing you can do right now in all of this is make sure that you're looking for the wins with your salespeople as you begin to implement the stuff that Joel talked about today.

Spot the win, celebrate it, and then keep leading with purpose. As always, take this information. Change your leadership, change your business, change your life. And join us on the next episode.